Finding Power and Presence Amid Ambiguity
with Leadership Coach Rae Ringel
What if the key to leading better isn't doing more—it's getting clearer about what you can actually control?
In this first episode of How We Future with Lisa Kay Solomon, Lisa is joined by leadership coach Rae Ringel to talk about showing up authentically in “swirly” times. Rae has spent decades helping C-suite leaders and teams become their best selves, and she's sharing the tools that actually work.
You'll learn:
Why "for now is not forever" is the mantra you need right now
How to spot the unarticulated request behind every complaint
Simple reframes that can change your entire day
Why spontaneity favors the practiced mind
Rae brings warmth, wisdom, and practical strategies to help you focus on what you can control. From teaching at Georgetown to coaching leaders as president of the Ringel Group, she's mastered the art of helping people show up better. Whether you're stressed about uncertainty, leading a team, or trying to be more present in daily life, this conversation will remind you: there's so much more in your control than you think.
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Lisa Kay Solomon: I'm Lisa Kay Solomon, and this is How We Future, where I talk to some of my favorite changemakers about shaping tomorrow starting today. My guest today is Rae Ringel, an executive coach, Georgetown professor, and founding president of The Ringel Group. Rae has built her career helping leaders and teams navigate knots in their systems, design better ways of working together, and feel more confident in their leadership practices.
Full disclosure, I've known Rae for over 40 years. We first met at summer camp and have been the closest friends ever since. Rae is one of those magical people that when she's in your life, you know that someone has your back, someone who is brilliant, funny, vibrant, and wise. In our conversation, Rae explains why fear is really about the future, how the simple phrase, for now is not forever, can shift everything, and why so many complaints are actually unspoken requests.
She'll share practical tools, from thought habits to meeting design, that help people feel more grounded, connected, and in control. If you've ever wished for more clarity, courage, or even some guidance on how to have more effective meetings, this episode is full of ideas you can put into practice right away. I'm so excited for you to learn from Rae on this episode of How We Future.
We welcome you to the podcast. We're mighty glad you're here. Julie Rae Ringel, welcome to How We Future Podcast.
So happy to have you here, one of my dearest friends, forever and favorite mentors and colleagues. I think everyone should have a best friend that's also a mentor and colleague. It's amazing. We are here today to talk about your expertise and what you do that helps people future better. By that, it means how they show up authentically. Leadership coach for many, many years, world-class facilitator. Actually started the facilitation program at Georgetown, put it on the map. I'm excited to talk to you about all the things. Thanks for being here.
Rae Ringel: So happy to be here.
Lisa: I started this podcast because I felt like in times of increasing complexity and change, we're having a hard time showing up. We're having a hard time showing up at all. First, I want to just start with your leadership work and how you got excited early on to help leaders become better versions of themselves, not only for work, but in their lives more generally. What drew you to this work?
Rae: I was always drawn to psychology and human beings. As you know this about me, human beings are my hobby. That is like the thing, human beings, their stories, relationships, friendships. I was always drawn to the psychology of the human being, but I wasn't drawn necessarily to the practice of therapy. I got fascinated early on on how systems and teams work.
That probably stems from being an athlete most of my life and really being part of a lot of different teams, sports teams, acapella teams, teams in high school, and really from a young age thinking about what made them work, what made them break down when they were breaking down, what was happening, what was not happening, what was the role of the coach and the leader. I just always had this deep fascination in the development of teams and systems. As I was moving through college and then thinking about graduate school, I just got fascinated by the whole, not only just group dynamics, but organizational development, organizational behavior.
I really started to lean into what motivates people, how do people change, can people actually change, what does it take for people to change, and how can people show up and be their best selves at work, at life, and in their community. That's always been the basis of my professional career is believing in people's infinite ability to change if they want to. That's a big part of it. Figuring out the right interventions to support people where they're at, to get them from where they are to where they want to be in a way that feels healthy and also that feels sustainable.
Lisa: Wait, sign me up. I'm ready. I'm ready.
Rae: Let's go.
Lisa: Let's do it. Let's talk about that a little bit. Why do people call you? What are some of the conditions in which they're like, "I really am stuck, I need some help?"
Rae: It's really three different areas. There's certainly the one-on-one coaching piece that people call me for, and that is probably more focused on C-suite leaders. I personally have a soft spot for young entrepreneurial women, having been one myself. I would say that I work with people on every level of the organization. Leadership is lonely. Leadership is hard. Having a thought partner that can help navigate turbulent times, navigate transition, navigate change. Coaching has always been very popular, very needed, I would say, now more than ever.
There's a big ask around the coaching, the one-on-one piece, a confidential space where people can really be pushed. That's one thing. The second area, I would say, in facilitation and design, is people still are not great at meetings, gatherings, retreats, conferences. Most people leave meetings saying, "I don't know exactly what happened, but I do know that I just lost an hour of my life." I am extremely committed to the concept of honoring people's time and spending people's time well because time is precious and time is part of our economy.
I spend a lot of time helping people and teaching people how to gather, how to do it well, how to make it actionable. Obviously, spent three years teaching people how to do that in the virtual world. Now working with people on how to continue doing that in the hybrid world and just our new world. This idea of how do you gather people and how do you create productive change in a way that makes sense is a huge part of my work. Then the third part of my work is just the teaching piece, is teaching people how to be more coach-like, or teaching them how to be facilitators, or teaching direct communication skills.
Working with people on professional development, doing lots of training and seminars. What I love so much about that is people bring me in to do very tactical work. How do I be a better fundraiser? How do I be a better communicator? How do I be a better public speaker? If you're going to get to the tactical, you've got to investigate the wound. You'll have to lift up the hood and find out what's the fear? What's getting in people's way? What are the obstacles?
You've got to heal the injury and figure out what's really going on in your inner game before you can really be working on your outer game. Even when I'm brought in to do the most tactical things, the psychologist in me is always trying to lift that hood and understand where the barriers are.
Lisa: That's so fantastic. I love that complete suite of meeting people where they are, but also helping them show up differently for their teams, helping them understand themselves better in the process. Iwant to dive a little bit into that last part, which I think is so powerful about helping people face their fears. It's a scary time right now. There's a lot coming at people that they've never experienced before.
They find themselves flat-footed. Some of the leadership models that they've used before or ways of showing up just don't feel exactly aligned with this moment. What are you telling people to practice? How are you helping them lean into this moment that feels a little extra, extra?
Rae: Extra, extra, and so swirly. And so destabilizing in so many ways. The first thing that I want to say, and this really relates to your expertise and your work in futures, is the thing about fear is that it's a future-based emotion. It's not always a current emotion. When someone has a fear of flying, they fear that when they get on an airplane, something will happen. It's not necessarily a current moment. It's anticipated loss. That's where the fear is coming from. They're scared that something will happen. It might not even be happening right now.
First and foremost, again, going back to that inner game, helping people make the distinction between what they're feeling right now in this moment and what they want to address or what they are anticipating or what is a future projection of a loss or an emotion. I think you have to help people make that distinction and be really conscious about that before you do any of the work. That's how it relates to the whole futures piece. Second thing is just an absolute validation of whatever you're feeling or wherever you're at, you get an A. You get an A in you.
It's not like we're trying to be like this or trying to be like that. Helping people understand that what they're feeling is valid, is real. Of course, I always tell you that I think I made this up, but I'm not sure, the concept that for now is not forever. Help people understand that what they're feeling right now is not how they will always feel. It's another really baseline concept you have to get through to people because when you feel like for now is forever, you can't even start. It's like if you're training for a marathon, you've got to think mile one. If you go to 26.2, you're never getting off your couch.
It's just like, what can I actually do? Trust me, that 0.2 at the end, as you know, is really intense. What can I actually do right now that will make a difference, that will make a change, that will just make some progress in terms of like, I have to stop feeling this way, and everything has to change because that's not real. Let's ground people in reality, and let's talk about what's real and what's for now. Then I would say the third step is really helping people understand what they can control and what they can't control. It sounds so basic.
We're spending so much time complaining and freaking out about things that are totally out of our control. I think if we've learned anything over the last-- I don't know, minimum five years, COVID, I don't know about you, but every day waking up being like, "Wait, what? No. No. No. What?" That and these awful fires and floods and wars and things that you just couldn't even imagine that are not in our control. The thing is, there's still so much that is in our control. I'm really pushing people to understand what they can control and lean way in.
Some of those things are how we show up, what our presence is, how we treat others, our generosity, and I mean generosity in relationships, at work, and even things like volunteering and philanthropy, things we can lean into and things we can control, and give people just a whole menu of things that they can control and get them to dive in deep and get better at those things. Ironically, that's what makes you feel more in control.
Lisa: I love that so much because it really relates to even why I'm doing this podcast, because we know the world does not need another podcast, but this idea of highlighting, "Wait, what is actually in our circle of control, and how do we think wider about the stuff that we can influence?" In doing that and flexing that agency becomes what I call the personal resilience strategy. Days are better. Days are better. Also, I want to flag there are a number of very important possible product opportunities for you. First of all, for now is not forever, bumper sticker, T-shirt, key chain.
Rae: Related to that, I think that I came up with the fact that the root of impossible is I'm possible. My daughter was like, "No, that's totally an internet meme. You did not come up with that," but I'm just going to claim it a little bit.
Lisa: A little bit. Just a little naming. Amplifying is part of it. [laughs] Inventing is overrated.
Rae: One more part of that that's really important that I don't want to forget to say is that it is hard to control how we feel. Feelings arise and feelings are in flux, and we could be on a continuum all day long of feeling elated and feeling despondent and feeling calm and feeling more-- Those things can change now in a nanosecond. It is hard to control the way that we feel, but what we can control are the thought habits that dominate our life.
That's probably the coaching tool that I use most, something called the Critical Thinking Path that was really seeded by my wonderful colleague, Alexander Kaye, this idea of what is the thought that is seeding the feelings, the actions, and the results that we're getting, and how might we choose and practice a different thought habit? This is something I talk about all the time. You practice it. It's not fake it till you make it.
It's think it till you become it. It's speak it till you become it. How might I choose a different way of thinking about this and practice it over and over until it becomes my reality? You've heard me talk about this before. This starts from a very young age. This starts with the seminal children's book, The Little Engine That Could.
Lisa: Favorite.
Rae: Ever. With a caboose who needs to pull the freight train up the mountain. I don't want to do a spoiler there for those of you who haven't read it, but essentially, the caboose starts with, I think I can, I think I can, I think I can, changing its neural pathways to be able to do the thing. From a young age, what would it look like if we were training our kids and the people we work with in what might be another thought that would serve you, that would make you feel more in control, and how do you practice it over and over until it becomes you?
Lisa: I think that idea of practice, and I know you're such a just unbelievable athlete to this day, diehard, is that athletes know that they don't get better if they don't practice. I think so much of the work that you do that is so spectacular with leaders is that you give them the space to practice. You help name these ways of showing up, ways that they can flex their growth mindset, their neuroplasticity, their idea that where you start is not necessarily where you need to end. You just have to start.
We're just not given the time. We're not given the invitation. We're not given the space. I've seen you do that over and over again with leaders. I love the idea. Imagine we had a little pad every day that we woke up to, and we're like, "Okay, what are the elements I'm going to influence today or control today?" Just that reminder of like, "Hey, do you have meetings? Did you set the agenda? How are you going to help people feel welcome?" Just to be reminded of all of the elements that we can influence by how we show up and by creating different spaces for others.
Rae: I think that's right. I love the pop-up idea. I used to do a lot of work in training fundraisers how to overcome their fear of asking people for charitable donations. I still do that work. That's a big passion of mine. Essentially, people would rather chew shards of glass than ask people for money. My whole thing in that reframing is, are you requesting a donation, and in some cases, begging, or are you making an offer? Are you offering someone to change the world? Are you offering someone the opportunity to perform a righteous act and to give charity?
People would say, "Can you record that, and I can play it in my car when I'm on the way to drive to a big donor's house?" Behind every complaint is an unarticulated request. A big one for me, which you know is our shared marathon wisdom, is never make a decision on a hill. Huge, not just for running, but for life. It's like, don't go to the supermarket when you're hungry. Pain is temporary. Pride is forever. I have-
Lisa: Reminders.
Rae: -reminders, I'm never going to be that person, Lee, during the day, who sits and meditates for five minutes. It's not the way that I center. The way that I center is through movement or through watching reels of dogs taking care of babies. I don't have a dog and I don't have a baby, but this is what centers me. There are ideas and thoughts that, through the day, I look to, and it's like, I'm back. I'm back to purpose. I'm back to what I can control.
You don't need a lava lamp and a yoga mat for that. By the way, we don't often have time because we usually have three minutes in between clients or this and that. What brings you back to purpose, to who you are, what your offer is, what your core is, what your primary thought habit is? If we can surround ourselves with that visually throughout the day, those centering pieces, I think it's a game-changer.
Lisa: I love that. You have so many great reframing ways. My kids say it now, and they credit Aunt Rae with it. I remember you were saying when you hear a siren in the street and it's so loud and deafening and you're like, "Oh, that siren is just too much." You taught me to instead say, "I hope they get there on time," honoring the work that they're doing, honoring why the siren is going off, and what it hopes to achieve. Now my kids will remind me, I hope they get there on time.
Rae: Then you're not annoyed. It brings you to a place of gratitude or hope, as opposed to, like, "I can't hear the person on my cell phone because the siren's so loud."
Lisa: Yes, like how this is affecting me versus like, "What is this giving to the world and why do I need to honor it?" There's so much of a spirit of generosity and uplifting in your work. I want to go back to something you just said earlier because again, another thing I've learned from you around this notion of: behind every complaint is a request. That's so brilliant. This idea of: you have to first of all notice that you are complaining, that you are saying something that is bothering you, and then to then have the ability to pause and say, "Wait a minute. What would it take to not feel this way? What is the request I can make?"
In fact, you are a regular contributor to HBR (Harvard Business Review). Your articles go viral. People love them because they're so real and accessible. One of my favorite ones is about how to make a request. Can you talk a little bit about that? Because I think in a world filled with so much unpredictability, learning how to make clear requests is probably one of the most powerful acts of agency that we have.
Rae: Oh, 100%. Just to give a little more context that I would say in 25 years of coaching, probably the two biggest issues that rise up for leaders, if I had to close my eyes and just think about what connects all these leaders together, it's typically tied for number one issues are I have to make a decision that will serve the organization that's going to be unpopular and that's going to make people unhappy, and I still want to be loved and respected. That's really in conflict. That's a big thing for people. The second thing is, why aren't people doing what they're supposed to be doing?
Lisa: I've never had that thought.
Rae: Never. One of the main things about the request, there's lots of reasons why we don't make requests, and the article goes into that, but a really big reason why we don't make requests is because we feel like we shouldn't have to. That comes up a lot in our personal life. How do you not know this is what I want and what I need? I know. Is this sounding familiar? You need to know this. I'm not going to tell you because you need to know this.
Then it's this idea of if I have to tell you that's fundamentally wrong, so I'm not going to make the request because you need to know this. Then I don't get what I want, and you have no idea what's happening. That leads to one of my other favorite lines that I attribute to my colleague Frank Ball, that says "The definition of resentment is when you fail to honor a request that I never made." I resent you for not doing the thing that I didn't ask you to. It happens at work, too.
Lisa: I know.
Rae: You need to know what your job is. If you don't know this, maybe you're not fit for the job. A big thing with leaders is, first of all, getting them on board with making the request and having that clear communication and making a clear request. Not like "It would be great if you could do this by the beginning of next week," when I think that's 8:00 AM on Monday and you think it's sometime before noon on Wednesday. What is the thing? It would be great if it even means just being really, really clear about what the request is, by when, and then having very clear responses. Yes. No.
Lisa: I was about to say, it reminds me that it is, again, an unpracticed skill that we can learn that is so powerful. I think the thing that people don't realize is that you're also doing the receiver a favor. You think you're imposing on them, but in fact, you're giving them a milestone with clarity that they can actually deliver against. That's so valuable in a world that's filled with so much unclearity.
It's like when I have a dinner party and I think name tags, name cards are the greatest gift ever. You don't need to think, "Who am I sitting next to?" That's not helpful. That's not helpful. Actually, give them a chance to enjoy the meal because you've been clear. Your point about, really, it's uncomfortable, but it's actually empowering. It's empowering for you, and it's empowering for them. The more clear you are, the better the relationship will be and the better the work will be.
Rae: I think one of Brené Brown's greatest lines ever is clear is kind. Clear is kind. Clear is kind to others. Even if it's something hard that you have to say, clear is kind. Having clarity is being kind to ourselves. Just being clear and not struggling so much or questioning or regretting. That's a big part of the request language being clear, having accountability. If I make a clear request to you and you say, "Sounds great," I don't know what that means. That's a non-response. We also have a culture of, "Sounds great. I'll get right to it. Let's take that offline. I'll get back to you." That means never.
There's just a lot of vague language, and all the more so when you're in a vague time in the world and a swirly time in the world, having vague and unclear and ambiguous communication is a huge trigger for people. They're just playing into what's going on in the environment. Another thing you can control is being really clear in your communication. The way that it connects back to complaints is if you can really lean into the idea that, pretty much behind every complaint, is an unarticulated request if you look for it. You can complain about having a headache, and you haven't asked for an Advil.
You can complain about not making enough money, but you haven't asked for a raise. What have you not yet asked for that is seeding the complaint, and what's holding you back from making that request? Usually, what's holding you back is the fear of a no answer because if I ask for that raise or promotion and you say no, I might have to leave my job. If I ask for something from my partner and they say no, I might have to find a new husband. JK, not happening. It's like that kind of thing. It's like those consequences of a no could be life-altering. I'd rather sit in pity city or a place of discomfort than to have to make the request and deal with the consequences of a no.
Lisa: It makes me think about how we sometimes get something from the safety of not asking. What is that place of complaint actually serving you in ways you may not realize? I think you're exactly right that if you just take it to its natural conclusion about what's uncomfortable about making that request, it's that there might be rejection on the other side. It's safer to protect yourself because then that means you actually have to do something different.
Rae: I'll give you a great current example. I'm working with this rockstar woman who desperately wants this promotion and is not asking for it. We call that a competing commitment. In really investigating, again, pulling up the hood, taking the band-aid off, what's going on there? What we've uncovered is she fears a yes because what would happen if she got the promotion? First, she's going to start supervising her friends.
Lisa: That's tricky.
Rae: Second of all, she's going to start traveling more and has young children. Third of all, what if I get that promotion and maybe they realize I have no idea what I'm doing? The whole imposter, am I actually good enough? She's withholding the request because she's actually fearing the yes, even though it's the thing that she wants. It's like these things are fascinating and complex, but if you're just honest about it, then you can start making traction. You can start making movements. There's so much behind the complaint and the request piece that both hold us back, and if we can work with it can absolutely set us free.
Lisa: My gosh. That's so powerful. I think a lot of people can relate to that. It gets back to something you said earlier about when you fear something, it's actually a future emotion. This idea of can we make it abstract and actually pregame, what could success look like without some of those worries, or how do we mitigate some of the downside of success? What if success is scary? How do we get ahead of that? That's such a powerful way to map out a better future that doesn't have to be filled with all those complexities and all the things that you're worried about. Super powerful.
Now, one of the things I've seen you do again and again is that you model what you do. You actually believe it, you do it. I know you've been a part of some high-stakes moments where things are going off the rails or something new has sparked, where you've had to do a real-time pivot. I think, again, that real-time pivot is something we don't practice enough or not taught about. We're just like, "No, it's either going to be successful or it's not," versus in the middle messy zone. I wonder if you could share just a little bit about your own practice of noticing things in real-time and making a shift.
Rae: One of the first pieces I ever wrote, many years ago, was actually about Peyton Manning and how he is the master of calling the audible. He's got the play. He is ready to go. Again, sorry, back to sports, even though I never played football. He sees something in the corner of his eye, sees something, like someone's movement or shoulder, and he changes the play on the spot because he senses it, and he sees. I think that's probably one of the most important things that I try to train our facilitators in. I want facilitators to walk into a room having spent days, weeks, months on a design, and it's beautifully laid out in their agenda.
I need them to go into the room and, at some point, realize that they might have to turn that piece of paper over and pivot because something else is happening in the room. You can only do that if you are in service to your participants and to the stakeholders who are in the room. If it's only about you getting through the agenda and whizzing through it, you will eliminate your ability to pivot. If you are really there for the people, it's scarier. You're going to walk into uncharted lands, and you might fumble a little bit, but it's not about you. It's about their experience.
I'm really tapped into that. It's a hard thing to teach because you need confidence, you need experience, but for me, it's more of a mindset and an attitude than anything else. I would say the last time that that really happened was when I was in Mexico City last year running a very large climate convening. We were in this really interesting, wild space. We had an ending planned, but it just felt like all of a sudden I was up on stage and realized that the ending just felt really intellectual and academic. I wanted them to drop from a head space more into a heart space.
All over the room, there were the values of this incredible organization, the Waverley Street Foundation. There were four values all over the room. I just had everyone get up, and they had to just walk. They had to move and stand under the value that they were most embodying or most connected to right now, and turn to the person next to them and talk about why. Then we did some open micing. I think the leaders of the conference were like, "What's happening?"
Lisa: Yes, what's happening? Oh, my gosh.
Rae: Trust me. I knew. I knew this is what had to happen. It was the right move. Later, someone asked me, "How did you know? How did you know in that moment to make a pivot?" I said, "For many years, I used to talk about this bird that would fly into the window. It was an invisible bird that would fly into the window and whisper the exact thing that I had to do in the moment." My students would be like, "Where do you get the bird? Where do you buy the bird?" It was so dumb, me and the bird. Then one of my students, many years ago at Georgetown, was like, "It's not a bird, Rae. You're practicing a sacred Buddhist concept."
I was like, "Oh, enlighten me. What am I practicing?" She said that spontaneity favors the practice mind, that when you know your stuff so well, when you are so tapped in to what the group needs, to what you're going to say, you're not looking at any notes, when you are so tapped in, you're not thinking about what comes next or what you're going to say next. Everything is available to you. We are inherently very creative beings. When you're not thinking about the next slide or the next word or the next move, all of a sudden, what comes to you is that thing that you actually have to do.
Lisa: It's so tapped into this idea of presence, of knowing who you are. Also, something that I've learned from you, another favorite, Raeism, is that we do so much better when our audio and our video are aligned. I think that's true for leaders of like, "Hey, if you have these values, live by them. Honor them. Really allow them to be expressed." I think that's true about who you are individually, but also organizations and cultures.
This breakdown in trust is when we feel like we can't rely on that because there's just so many broken promises of like, "Hey, we say we care about people," but then you actually behave in totally different ways, or "We love our customers," and actually, there's no sign of a company actually loving their customers. I love that quote, spontaneity favors the practiced mind. Some of that comes back to like, what have you been practicing? Have you been practicing your values? Do you know what they look like when you feel it unfolding?
Rae: That's really, really hard right now. I think what people are struggling with is that lack of congruence between the audio and the video. We're saying we are a values-based organization, that we care for the full person, and yet you've sent me a text message after 15 years telling me to pack my office in the next half an hour. Or we say we are committed to your development, and there's been a professional development budget freeze for two years, and people are like, "I don't even know what to believe anymore." That again is an example of something that is out of your control. What can you do in that situation to regain some of that control?
I think that means who's on your team, how do you model it? Even if you are the happiest little department in an organization that feels toxic and unhealthy, what are the pieces that you can model that you can do? How do you treat people well? How do you onboard them? How do you end well when you have to end? Something that's really important. What are the pieces? How are you with your customers, even if the organization isn't that way with its customers? You have to really get honest about what is your locus of control, and really model the way with what you can.
Lisa: Can I just give you a real-world story?
Rae: Yes.
Lisa: We are recording this when I am in my very beloved hometown of Philadelphia. When I'm in Philadelphia, one of the things I love to do is go to Wawa every day.
Rae: Have hazelnut coffee.
Lisa: Hazelnut coffee with a hazelnut creamer. Hello. It is dessert for breakfast, and it's just divine. I love Wawa. For those that don't know, Wawa is essentially a convenience store, plus, plus, plus, plus. It's so much more than that. It's a community. It's a way of being. If you're from the tri-state area, you know Wawa. When I come to Philly, I go to Wawa every day. So far, three out of three days, I have seen this guy behind the cash register named Jim, who literally greets every single customer as if they are best friends. He is like, "What's happening, brother?"
Rae: Does that not make you feel special, or it makes you feel that he's treating everyone this way?
Lisa: No, it makes everybody feel special. He is literally taking people's money or getting their Apple Pay or whatever, but it is probably the brightest spot in most people's days. I said, "Jim, first of all, thank you for encouraging me to get my Wawa rewards, because now I'm going to get some rewards for it, because I signed up for the app." Talk about customer acquisition. All it took was Jim. I literally said to him, I was like, "Jim, who is the manager of the store, because I'm literally going to be emailing him to tell them how fantastic you are."
I just think about going back to what we've been talking about around the locus of control. You might say Jim may not have the most glamorous job in the world, but his ability to ignite joy and appreciation and connection and community just by how he greets people in the 15-second exchange, it blows my mind. That's what this podcast is about, how we future. How we future is how we show up is how we treat others.
Do we choose to smile at someone when we pass by them? I always think, "How do you measure a day?" I'm like, "Did you make people smile? Did you make them feel seen? Did you honor them when they walked into that meeting that they were dreading and do something that they didn't expect that reminds them of their humanity?" So much more is in our control than we appreciate.
Rae: Riffing off of the word appreciate, I don't want to forget to say that it's a huge piece in not only creating new futures, but when things feel really swirly. Going that extra mile of sharing appreciation, very specific appreciation of someone who has done something, someone who has done extra customer service, I feel like, as a personal value, that's something that I always do. It also comes from my religious background of expressing gratitude is really important to me. I've been leaning into it more and more. It costs no money and takes very few extra minutes. It is an absolute game-changer to share-
Lisa: Game-changer.
Rae: -with people the impact that they have had. I'm into small but mighty. You will relate to this, and you will find this hilarious that, for example, people have feelings about New York and New Yorkers maybe being unfriendly. When I'm in New York and I see people looking at maps and trying to figure out where they are, I always stop and ask if I can help. Now, if they have to get somewhere below 14th Street, as we know, they are on their own. I can only do the grid. I'm pretty much only on the Upper West Side. My thing is I want them to know that someone's watching out for them.
Lisa: Totally.
Rae: How can I help you? Because in the future, they might think, "New York's a friendly place. I can come back here. People are kind here." We don't even realize how we can be the ambassador of good for countries, cities, religions, institutions, by the way that we show up, by the way we care, and how we express appreciation. Literally, this is Psychology 101. That changes people's minds.
Lisa: It's incredible. It costs nothing. It's a total reframe, a total abundance mindset, like, "Hey, I'm noticing. I happen to notice you're looking at a map." I wonder if this may mean that they could use help. Can I be of assistance? I love the Upper West Side, which is really all you know, and we know.
Rae: All I know. All I know.
Lisa: It's a very bountiful area in New York City.
Rae: Very bountiful. The other thing that I wanted to share, which goes back to what you were saying about abundance, which is one of my favorite stories of all times, but my alma mater for college, someone had been trying to get in touch with me for a really, really, really long time for a fundraising conversation. I kept saying, "Maybe next week. I'm out of town here. I'm out of the country here."
I was actually not being clear with the request. I have to say, I wasn't just flat out saying no. Finally, I said to this guy-- This is now six months of back and forth, I said, "I'm landing in LaGuardia. I'll have about 30, 45 minutes in the cab on my way to Midtown. Let's talk then." When he finally called me and he finally got me on the phone, what do you think the first thing he said to me was? What would most people say after trying to get in touch for six months?
Lisa: I think most people would say, "Oh, it's been so hard to get in touch with you." I imagine he said, "Thank you so much for this time."
Rae: Not even. What most people would say is, "Wow. It's been quite a journey."
Lisa: “Wow, you're busy.”
Rae: "You're one busy lady."
Lisa: You're busy.
Rae: 9 out of 10. This guy, Derek Swanson-
Lisa: Derek.
Rae: -I've never met him in my whole life.
Lisa: Shout out.
Rae: Shout out to Derek Swanson. I got on the phone. He said, "Wow, it sounds like you lead one hell of an exciting life. I'd love to hear more about it." I was like, "How much time do you have?" An hour later, I'm standing on the corner in Midtown. His whole mindset and approach was like, "Tell me more. No shaming. No, you're so hard to get in touch with. I'm fascinated. Who are you? What are you about?" All the things. It was actually a transformative conversation. I just thought, I don't know how old this guy is or who he is, but he knew the exact thing to say because he just acted from a place of gratitude and curiosity.
Lisa: Right. Amazing. Desire to learn more. Oh, my gosh. I love that. We so appreciate the focus on, again, those micro moments that you might be able to influence just by how you show up, just by how you smile, just by how you greet someone. In my family, we call them mensch-7 moments. When we are at our best, we have a weekly reflection of when has someone been mensch-y to you and when have you been mensch-y to someone, just to note it. For those of you that don't know, one of my favorite words in the-- I'm going to call it English, but it's really Yiddish language, is mensch, being a mensch. What does it mean to be a good person? Just naming it.
Rae, I could talk to you forever. You know I can. We're going to list all kinds of your amazing articles in the show notes, including how we can all be inspired by HIIT exercises to run better meetings, one of my favorites, and your ability to connect the dots in the most useful way, an accessible way, is second to none. I can't end this without talking about how we are going to see each other this upcoming weekend, we will be on the other side of it by the time this posts.
You and I, we met each other over four decades ago at our overnight summer camp, and we are about to head into a mega camp reunion. What are you looking forward to most in going back?
Rae: It's the 75th anniversary of our camp.
Lisa: Talk about a transformational experience, going to overnight camp, being away from your family, figuring out who you are in the world.
Rae: Growing up at summer camp with a group of women who, yes, 44 years ago, we're still BFF, I didn't even know at the time how much I needed it, how much I needed the sisterhood, and just for other things I was going through in my life and transitions I was going through in my life. It taught me how to be a friend, and it taught me how to be a competitor, and it taught me about different kinds of fun that you can have, the silliest fun you can have, and constructed fun that you can have. It just taught me so much about what it means to be real and authentic.
I think just going back to that space where it all began, it's funny because my mother went to this camp, and one of my daughters ended up going to this camp, but that sisterhood is something that has shaped me for my whole life. Again, just being on the bottom bunk because I can't sleep on the top because of sleepwalking, getting that infusion again with those women, that is the thing that I'm most excited for. I feel like the outcome of this is going to be the force multiplier of good. That really is what comes back to this idea of futures. I guess it was Mahatma Gandhi who said it the best. Be the change you want to see in the world. Be the friend you want to see in the world.
Lisa: Be the song leader.
Rae: Be the song leader. Be the sister. I think that I'm going to be with a lot of like-minded women who were raised with those values, and that's such a gift and such a privilege. Most of all, having that with you, that's going to be the most special.
Lisa: No, it's so true. Transformational time, laying down the tracks of what it's like to feel genuine joy.
Rae: Genuine joy.
Lisa: Genuine joy that is often just emergent, organic. The other thing about camp, which I so appreciate, is that it created the structure for that, that there were some things we could rely on, some traditions that we could come back to, rituals that we can bring in. I sometimes think, "What if every company had a canteen?"
Rae: Some of them do. They have junk drawers, and it's actually great.
Lisa: It's great.
Rae: You're right. Or cheers, or color war, and even things like everyone is a winner, and sometimes they're not. That's a whole other part of our culture in the future. Having a healthy relationship to winning and losing and what that's about. I know there's a lot of books that everything I learned, I learned from summer camp, like kindergarten, but I really believe that. I really believe that.
Lisa: No, it's so true. Thank you for being my bunkmate, [laughs] my camp sister for now so many years. You are the gift that keeps on giving. I cannot wait. I think that we're going to have to have another episode about futuring through camp. It's just how we future camp.
Rae: I think we should do it as a musical.
Lisa: A musical?
Rae: I'm willing to write it.
Lisa: Yes, I know you are.
Rae: I'm willing to. We didn't even get into Ringel's Jingles. I can write it, and we can perform it, and we'll see how that lands for creating new futures.
Lisa: Also, new awards. Who doesn't need a Spirit Award at camp? Who doesn't need one?
Rae: Who doesn't need one?
Lisa: Who doesn't need one? Anyway, Julie Rae Ringel, you're a gift to me, you're a gift to everyone that gets to learn and work with you. Thank you so much for being on How We Future.
Rae: Love it.
Lisa: Thanks so much for listening to this episode of How We Future with Rae Ringel. I loved hearing her stories about practicing pivots in real time and surrounding ourselves with things that remind us of our purpose. It feels especially timely to remember that spontaneity favors the practice mind and that even the smallest gestures of appreciation can ripple outward. I hope you'll tune in next time for more conversations on shaping the future optimistically, practically, and joyfully. If you like the podcast, please review it and share it with others. I'm Lisa Kay Solomon, and I hope you have an amazing week.
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Links from the episode:
HBR 5 Pandemic-Era Lessons on Leadership Through Dramatic Change (co-authored with Lisa Kay Solomon)
Rae’s new facilitation certification for professionals program is going live soon at UVA!
More about Rae:
Bonus: Learn about Camp Robindel for Girls (because that’s where Lisa and Rae met and where magic happens)
